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SFO Runway ops
Question:
> Actually, they sometimes take off from 19. > I was taking the TWA red-eye to STL on an L1011 and I was quite > surprised when we started taxing out to the bay-end of the runway. We > obviously went up pretty fast, and then made a quick left. > Since I used to live in San Bruno, which is directly west of the > airport, it was quite weird. 
Yes they do! Last Thursday I took off on 19R on the way to Denver. It was the first time I have used a runway 19 in the 17 years I have been flying for United. It was a wild a wooly ride until we got above the the tops of the hills to the west. Ed
Response:
SFO has two "plans" for T/O and landing: (1) The Northwest Plan, and (2) The Southeast Plan. Why these particular directions, one might wonder. Well, the airports of the Bay Area are oriented with runways into the prevailing winds, which come from the Northwest (approx. 315 degrees). Hence, you will see runways (which are numbered by magnetic heading divided by 10) 28, 29, 30, and 31 (corresponding to 280, 290, 300, and 310). When winds are more than 15 degrees off the runway, ALL fixed-wing aircraft have a little problem. Hence, the runway headings minimize the difference between wind and runway direction. BUT . . . what happens when the Bay Area has a storm? The winds change to predominantly southern. Hence, the Bay Area goes to the Southeast Plan. That’s the entire Bay Area, not just SFO. (Things would be a complete mess if, say, Oakland were landing NW and SFO SE!) Hence, the wind could have been calm enough for landings as usual at SFO. Either another airport needed the Southeast Plan and the entire Bay Area shifted or the controllers had not simply reverted to business as usual. And it is as usual. The Southeast Plan gets used, I was told by the fine scope minders at Bay Tracon, about 5 days a year. The pressure is really on them then, since they haven’t done things this way in quite a while. — Michael Slaughter, The Izzat of Quincunx Box 301 Pacifica CA 94044 << L’imagination au pouvoir. >>
Response:
> In the last 3 years I have frequently arrived/departed/connected at SFO. > In every instance, the runway usage has been the same: landings on > 28L and 28R, departures on 1L and 1R. UNTIL… last week, on weekday > evening connection, I experienced a reversal and inversion–we landed on > 19R and took off on 10L. I was seriously disoriented as we flew north past > San Jose and stayed east of the bay, till I heard Bay Approach say > "19R" and I got my bearings as we turned west over OAK. My question is, > how common is this? (rare, I assume, since it was my first time in about > 40 visits to SFO) Also, is this solely weather/wind related (tower > reported "winds calm" as we were cleared to land), or perhaps due to > some noise abatement regulations? I was rather surprised at landing
This (land 19/depart 10) is the normal wet weather configuration. When rainy weather moves into the bay, the winds usually reverse and virtually every bay area airport turns around. Reversing is not easy so they don’t change unless they have to – a brief "winds calm" is not enough. Oakland follows whatever San Francisco does but San Jose can use the 12s even if SFO is arriving 28 (but San Jose must use the 12s if SFO goes to the 19/10 configuration). > on 19, since a go-around right at touchdown would have us heading straight > for the tall hills just west of the field (I’m assuming take-offs on 19 > are not permitted?).
You assume wrong. Last Thursday afternoon I saw the 19s being used for departures. I’ve used every runway direction for both landing and departing except for landing on the 1s. A 19 departure has an immediate left turn. — Larry Stone | United Airlines VAX Systems Administrator | Maintenance Operations Center
Response:
when ever there is lots of fog its really common here Ravi
: In the last 3 years I have frequently arrived/departed/connected at SFO. : In every instance, the runway usage has been the same: landings on : 28L and 28R, departures on 1L and 1R. UNTIL… last week, on weekday : evening connection, I experienced a reversal and inversion–we landed on : 19R and took off on 10L. I was seriously disoriented as we flew north past : San Jose and stayed east of the bay, till I heard Bay Approach say : "19R" and I got my bearings as we turned west over OAK. My question is, : how common is this? (rare, I assume, since it was my first time in about : 40 visits to SFO) Also, is this solely weather/wind related (tower : reported "winds calm" as we were cleared to land), or perhaps due to : some noise abatement regulations? I was rather surprised at landing : on 19, since a go-around right at touchdown would have us heading straight : for the tall hills just west of the field (I’m assuming take-offs on 19 : are not permitted?). : Gautam Shah — ______ FLY OUR FRIENDLY SKIES (oo=OO=oo) (415) 634 4002 []""""""[] __|__ __|__ __|__ *—o0o—* *—o0o—* *—o0o—* | __|__ | _ _|_ _ (_)-/ -(_) _ /___/ _ _____/
Response:
In the last 3 years I have frequently arrived/departed/connected at SFO. In every instance, the runway usage has been the same: landings on 28L and 28R, departures on 1L and 1R. UNTIL… last week, on weekday evening connection, I experienced a reversal and inversion–we landed on 19R and took off on 10L. I was seriously disoriented as we flew north past San Jose and stayed east of the bay, till I heard Bay Approach say "19R" and I got my bearings as we turned west over OAK. My question is, how common is this? (rare, I assume, since it was my first time in about 40 visits to SFO) Also, is this solely weather/wind related (tower reported "winds calm" as we were cleared to land), or perhaps due to some noise abatement regulations? I was rather surprised at landing on 19, since a go-around right at touchdown would have us heading straight for the tall hills just west of the field (I’m assuming take-offs on 19 are not permitted?). Gautam Shah
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >In the last 3 years I have frequently arrived/departed/connected at SFO. >In every instance, the runway usage has been the same: landings on >28L and 28R, departures on 1L and 1R. UNTIL… last week, on weekday >evening connection, I experienced a reversal and inversion–we landed on >19R and took off on 10L. I was seriously disoriented as we flew north past >San Jose and stayed east of the bay, till I heard Bay Approach say >"19R" and I got my bearings as we turned west over OAK. My question is, >how common is this? (rare, I assume, since it was my first time in about >40 visits to SFO) Also, is this solely weather/wind related (tower >reported "winds calm" as we were cleared to land), or perhaps due to >some noise abatement regulations? I was rather surprised at landing >on 19, since a go-around right at touchdown would have us heading straight >for the tall hills just west of the field (I’m assuming take-offs on 19 >are not permitted?). >Gautam Shah
Actually, they sometimes take off from 19. I was taking the TWA red-eye to STL on an L1011 and I was quite surprised when we started taxing out to the bay-end of the runway. We obviously went up pretty fast, and then made a quick left. Since I used to live in San Bruno, which is directly west of the airport, it was quite weird. — Glendale, AZ "If there is no God, who pops up the next Kleenex?"