Business History Books » Business Plans » Gas/Real Log for Fireplace
Gas/Real Log for Fireplace
Question:
You could take up smoking pot. Kinda smells like a fireplace.
Response:
Yes, the gas valve must be removed from the inside of the fireplace in order to burn wood. It can go in the wall or in the hearth. Sometimes it is easier to go in the floor in front of the hearth, they make valves that are flush with the floor with brass/chrome covers for this purpose. The code requires the valve and burner to be within 6′ of each other so it can be lit by one person. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I am thinking about trying the "Texasframe" fireplace grate and burn > work but I would like use a gas starter, as suggested below. The > previous gas log was removed at the valve. My question is, " Do I have > to remove the gas shutoff valve from the inside of the fireplace and > if I do where do I place it for the gas starter ?" >There is not a gas log set that can have real wood added to it. You >could remove the burner and valve (if inside the firebox) and install a >gas starter for lighting wood logs. >> I have a fireplace that had a gas log in it that the previous owner >> took with him. I was going to put in a gas log but my wife likes the >> smell of a fire. Are there any gas logs on the market that can have a >> piece of wood place on it to be burned? Something just to give the >> oder of a real fire.
– John Galbreath Jr. http://www.FireLogs.com http://www.ABSCOFireplace.com Birmingham, Alabama 888.321.Logs
Response:
> I am thinking about trying the "Texasframe" fireplace grate and burn > work but I would like use a gas starter, as suggested below. The > previous gas log was removed at the valve. My question is, " Do I have > to remove the gas shutoff valve from the inside of the fireplace and > if I do where do I place it for the gas starter ?"
I recommend against the gas starter with the Texas Fireframe. First, you don’t need it. I can always start the fire first time with three pieces of newspaper and no kindling. Second, you want the fire *between* the two layers of logs, eventually burning the lower layer through. In spite of the intense IR it throws out, this is a very slow burning fire. The wood lasts a long time. More importantly, you don’t have a huge updraft in the chimney sucking air out of your house. I suspect that if you were to ignite the logs of the Texas Fireframe with a gas starter like those of my friends, you would quickly have a roaring fire that does not fully exploit the design advantages. I am open to experience to the contrary, but gas starters I have seen give big roaring fires shortly after ignition. This is inefficient. At least try the Texas Fireframe without the gas starter to see if you really think it is worth it. You will be amazed how easily it starts. My technique is to take each of three full size (two-page) newspaper pages, roll it loosely diagonally into a tube, then tie the tube into a loose knot. Put all three into the cavity between the logs, and light all three. That’s it. You will have a nice orange glow from the logs in minutes. — Department of Physics http://www.wfu.edu/~matthews Wake Forest University 336-758-5340 (Voice) Winston-Salem, NC 27109-7507 336-758-6142 (FAX) USA
Response:
I am thinking about trying the "Texasframe" fireplace grate and burn work but I would like use a gas starter, as suggested below. The previous gas log was removed at the valve. My question is, " Do I have to remove the gas shutoff valve from the inside of the fireplace and if I do where do I place it for the gas starter ?" – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >There is not a gas log set that can have real wood added to it. You >could remove the burner and valve (if inside the firebox) and install a >gas starter for lighting wood logs. > I have a fireplace that had a gas log in it that the previous owner > took with him. I was going to put in a gas log but my wife likes the > smell of a fire. Are there any gas logs on the market that can have a > piece of wood place on it to be burned? Something just to give the > oder of a real fire.
Response:
> This is interesting. Where would one find this product or at least > plans to make one?
Someone just mailed me the URL: http://texasfireframe.com/. Let me reiterate that these things are fantastic. You get a LOT more heat, the fire starts easier, and it uses less wood. No need for kindling at all. You will never have a big roaring fire that sucks air out of your house and burns up wood quickly. Just a steady intense orange glow from between the two layers of logs. Turns a purely decorative fireplace into a real source of heat. Rick – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Years ago Scientific American featured a product called the Texas >Fireframe, a.k.a., the "Physicist’s Fire." It was a simple modification >of a grate, adding two vertical bars to the front which supported >two horizontal bars which hold a second layer of small logs above >the layer on the grate. A large log at the back forms a cavity surrounded >above, below, and behind, but open to the front. You build a fire >in this cavity. I bought one, and found that the fire starts first >time every time with three sheets of newspaper and no kindling. Very >quickly, there is an orange glow in the cavity beaming heat out the >only direction it can — out the front across the room. It is fantastic. >Does its thing even in the cubical fireplaces you find in modern houses. >No stoking of the fire. It burns relatively slowly but delivers a lot >of heat. >Haven’t seen an ad in years. Anyone know if they are still in business?
– Department of Physics http://www.wfu.edu/~matthews Wake Forest University 336-758-5340 (Voice) Winston-Salem, NC 27109-7507 336-758-6142 (FAX) USA
Response:
I want to thank everyone for their replies. This thread seems particularly interesting in that it raises a questions, "Are there any fireplace inserts that burn like a wood stove with a catalytic converter and circulation fan?" I had a friend with one of these woodstoves in MA that kept the house VERY warm even though it was in a room with a 16 foot cathedral ceiling. The catalytic converter was always VERY hot but the air blowing out of the circulation fan was also warm but not too warm as to burn your hand. In fact we had to shutdown the air vents to the firebox to reduce the heat output. Does something like this exist for a fireplace? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >Most fireplaces do not warm the air with a fan above 98.6 degrees at the >grill outlet, therefore the air "feels" cold. Like what the air from a >heat pump feels like. The more expensive, energy efficient fireplaces >do a better job. IMO, a ceiling fan in the same room is a better >investment. > Re: Gas/Real Log for Fireplace > Blue flame is a very clean flame with MUCH oxygen. A lack of oxygen > created a yellow/gold flame. It sounds like you have a Majestic Vent > Free unit. Look in the installation instructions about mantle > clearances. As I do not sell Majestic gas products (I do sell their > fireplaces), click this link to a similar manual about clearances: > http://www.FireLogs.com/PDF/RasC3Installation.pdf. Please look at the > manual that came with your unit or contact Majestic for a replacement at > http://www.MajesticProducts.com. The link I provided is only for > reference, you actual model may have greater or lesser clearances. As a > general rule, if you cannot hold your hand on it forever, it is too hot. > IMO, most fireplace fans are not worth the money. > Curious as to the reason you state " most fireplace fans are not worth > the money". > Are you referring to energy usage, comfort, act of keeping a lower > temperature within the exchanger envelope and surface? > John Williamson
Response:
This is interesting. Where would one find this product or at least plans to make one? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I would like to add another track to this thread. >Most modern fireplaces are not designed to be efficient. Conventional >fireplace warm only by radiation, and the standard nearly cubical >firebox you see in most modern homes delivers very little radiant heat to >the home. This presents challenges whether you use real logs or >vented gas logs. Many fireplaces have negative efficiency in a >warm house, exhausting more heat up the chimney than they deliver. >Look in old houses that depended on the fireplaces for heat and you >will see that they are much taller than they are deep. The back wall >slopes forward, so that the brick is warmed by the rising hot >air, subsequently radiating that heat back into the room. >Years ago Scientific American featured a product called the Texas >Fireframe, a.k.a., the "Physicist’s Fire." It was a simple modification >of a grate, adding two vertical bars to the front which supported >two horizontal bars which hold a second layer of small logs above >the layer on the grate. A large log at the back forms a cavity surrounded >above, below, and behind, but open to the front. You build a fire >in this cavity. I bought one, and found that the fire starts first >time every time with three sheets of newspaper and no kindling. Very >quickly, there is an orange glow in the cavity beaming heat out the >only direction it can — out the front across the room. It is fantastic. >Does its thing even in the cubical fireplaces you find in modern houses. >No stoking of the fire. It burns relatively slowly but delivers a lot >of heat. >Haven’t seen an ad in years. Anyone know if they are still in business?
Response:
I would like to add another track to this thread. Most modern fireplaces are not designed to be efficient. Conventional fireplace warm only by radiation, and the standard nearly cubical firebox you see in most modern homes delivers very little radiant heat to the home. This presents challenges whether you use real logs or vented gas logs. Many fireplaces have negative efficiency in a warm house, exhausting more heat up the chimney than they deliver. Look in old houses that depended on the fireplaces for heat and you will see that they are much taller than they are deep. The back wall slopes forward, so that the brick is warmed by the rising hot air, subsequently radiating that heat back into the room. Years ago Scientific American featured a product called the Texas Fireframe, a.k.a., the "Physicist’s Fire." It was a simple modification of a grate, adding two vertical bars to the front which supported two horizontal bars which hold a second layer of small logs above the layer on the grate. A large log at the back forms a cavity surrounded above, below, and behind, but open to the front. You build a fire in this cavity. I bought one, and found that the fire starts first time every time with three sheets of newspaper and no kindling. Very quickly, there is an orange glow in the cavity beaming heat out the only direction it can — out the front across the room. It is fantastic. Does its thing even in the cubical fireplaces you find in modern houses. No stoking of the fire. It burns relatively slowly but delivers a lot of heat. Haven’t seen an ad in years. Anyone know if they are still in business? — Department of Physics http://www.wfu.edu/~matthews Wake Forest University 336-758-5340 (Voice) Winston-Salem, NC 27109-7507 336-758-6142 (FAX) USA
Response:
Most fireplaces do not warm the air with a fan above 98.6 degrees at the grill outlet, therefore the air "feels" cold. Like what the air from a heat pump feels like. The more expensive, energy efficient fireplaces do a better job. IMO, a ceiling fan in the same room is a better investment. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Re: Gas/Real Log for Fireplace > Blue flame is a very clean flame with MUCH oxygen. A lack of oxygen > created a yellow/gold flame. It sounds like you have a Majestic Vent > Free unit. Look in the installation instructions about mantle > clearances. As I do not sell Majestic gas products (I do sell their > fireplaces), click this link to a similar manual about clearances: > http://www.FireLogs.com/PDF/RasC3Installation.pdf. Please look at the > manual that came with your unit or contact Majestic for a replacement at > http://www.MajesticProducts.com. The link I provided is only for > reference, you actual model may have greater or lesser clearances. As a > general rule, if you cannot hold your hand on it forever, it is too hot. > IMO, most fireplace fans are not worth the money. > Curious as to the reason you state " most fireplace fans are not worth > the money". > Are you referring to energy usage, comfort, act of keeping a lower > temperature within the exchanger envelope and surface? > John Williamson
– John Galbreath Jr. http://www.FireLogs.com http://www.ABSCOFireplace.com Birmingham, Alabama 888.321.Logs
Response:
Re: Gas/Real Log for Fireplace Blue flame is a very clean flame with MUCH oxygen. A lack of oxygen created a yellow/gold flame. It sounds like you have a Majestic Vent Free unit. Look in the installation instructions about mantle clearances. As I do not sell Majestic gas products (I do sell their fireplaces), click this link to a similar manual about clearances: http://www.FireLogs.com/PDF/RasC3Installation.pdf. Please look at the manual that came with your unit or contact Majestic for a replacement at http://www.MajesticProducts.com. The link I provided is only for reference, you actual model may have greater or lesser clearances. As a general rule, if you cannot hold your hand on it forever, it is too hot. IMO, most fireplace fans are not worth the money.
Curious as to the reason you state " most fireplace fans are not worth the money". Are you referring to energy usage, comfort, act of keeping a lower temperature within the exchanger envelope and surface? John Williamson
Response:
since I got ya, back to my blue flame problems in my fireplace, it’s a majestic, came with the house and was inspected 3 months ago. I find the flame is very blue, and am also worried about how hot the wall above gets, it’s almost to hot to touch!! I assumes there is a lack of oxygen causing the blue flame if so how-to correct? also, are fans of any benefit for a gas fire place? thanks — Alive and well….. . – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> There is not a gas log set that can have real wood added to it. You > could remove the burner and valve (if inside the firebox) and install a > gas starter for lighting wood logs. > I have a fireplace that had a gas log in it that the previous owner > took with him. I was going to put in a gas log but my wife likes the > smell of a fire. Are there any gas logs on the market that can have a > piece of wood place on it to be burned? Something just to give the > oder of a real fire. > — > John Galbreath Jr. > http://www.FireLogs.com > http://www.ABSCOFireplace.com > Birmingham, Alabama > 888.321.Logs
Response:
Blue flame is a very clean flame with MUCH oxygen. A lack of oxygen created a yellow/gold flame. It sounds like you have a Majestic Vent Free unit. Look in the installation instructions about mantle clearances. As I do not sell Majestic gas products (I do sell their fireplaces), click this link to a similar manual about clearances: http://www.FireLogs.com/PDF/RasC3Installation.pdf. Please look at the manual that came with your unit or contact Majestic for a replacement at http://www.MajesticProducts.com. The link I provided is only for reference, you actual model may have greater or lesser clearances. As a general rule, if you cannot hold your hand on it forever, it is too hot. IMO, most fireplace fans are not worth the money. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > since I got ya, back to my blue flame problems in my fireplace, it’s a > majestic, came with the house and was inspected 3 months ago. > I find the flame is very blue, and am also worried about how hot the wall > above gets, it’s almost to hot to touch!! > I assumes there is a lack of oxygen causing the blue flame if so how-to > correct? > also, are fans of any benefit for a gas fire place? > thanks > — > Alive and well….. > . > There is not a gas log set that can have real wood added to it. You > could remove the burner and valve (if inside the firebox) and install a > gas starter for lighting wood logs. > > I have a fireplace that had a gas log in it that the previous owner > > took with him. I was going to put in a gas log but my wife likes the > > smell of a fire. Are there any gas logs on the market that can have a > > piece of wood place on it to be burned? Something just to give the > > oder of a real fire. > — > John Galbreath Jr. > http://www.FireLogs.com > http://www.ABSCOFireplace.com > Birmingham, Alabama > 888.321.Logs
– John Galbreath Jr. http://www.FireLogs.com http://www.ABSCOFireplace.com Birmingham, Alabama 888.321.Logs
Response:
I have a fireplace that had a gas log in it that the previous owner took with him. I was going to put in a gas log but my wife likes the smell of a fire. Are there any gas logs on the market that can have a piece of wood place on it to be burned? Something just to give the oder of a real fire.
Response:
How about a gas starter (to start your real logs)? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I have a fireplace that had a gas log in it that the previous owner > took with him. I was going to put in a gas log but my wife likes the > smell of a fire. Are there any gas logs on the market that can have a > piece of wood place on it to be burned? Something just to give the > oder of a real fire.
Response:
> I have a fireplace that had a gas log in it that the previous owner > took with him. I was going to put in a gas log but my wife likes the > smell of a fire. Are there any gas logs on the market that can have a > piece of wood place on it to be burned? Something just to give the > oder of a real fire.
If she likes a real fire, Have her go out and haul the wood in and clean out the ashes after a real fire. She’ll quickly give up the smell of a real fore for the ease and convenience of just turning a knob. 
Response:
There is not a gas log set that can have real wood added to it. You could remove the burner and valve (if inside the firebox) and install a gas starter for lighting wood logs. > I have a fireplace that had a gas log in it that the previous owner > took with him. I was going to put in a gas log but my wife likes the > smell of a fire. Are there any gas logs on the market that can have a > piece of wood place on it to be burned? Something just to give the > oder of a real fire.
– John Galbreath Jr. http://www.FireLogs.com http://www.ABSCOFireplace.com Birmingham, Alabama 888.321.Logs