Business History Books » Business Plans » BAe 146/Good Airline Service
BAe 146/Good Airline Service
Question:
> Richard> What is the cheapest cost for a frequent flyer mile? > [...] > Richard> Anyone get anything else below 2 cents per mile? > I pay $50/year for my Citibank AAdvantage VISA card, and can typically > charge well over $5000/year (grocery stores here take credit > cards…). That’s 5000 miles for $50, or 1 cent per mile. Of course,
[...] You can get 5 FF miles on American or Northwestern per dollar spent on MCI long distance calls. In other words, the miles fall out for free, basically. You can then get an additional mile per dollar by having your MCI bill charged to your Citibank AAdvantage card. —
Response:
> RS> With reference to which airlines use BAe146’s, I think another DL > RS> affiliate, Comair, also has started using Bae146’s on several > RS> routes. >Comair has no BAe146/AvroRJ aircraft. All their jets are Canadair >Regional Jets, which they are using on many routes, including >Cincinnati-Providence (RI) and to Canada. >–
I might add here that Comair has taken over routes that Delta has left.. but this has already been pointed out. Comair also has taken over certain flights that Delta once operated.. to Minneapolis for example. Delta flies from CVG to MSP with jets, although there is one Comair flight a day (the morning one) from CVG to MSP with the CRJ. -Noah Cole — "I believe in the future we shall suffer no more"- Paul Simon, Cool Cool River
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> Although Several airlines operated the 146 in the US (AirCal, PSA, >Presidential, later USAir, American) only Air Wisconsin and Business Express >are still using them,
What about United Express on the west coast? (I think the real name of the airline is Westair.) They were using them earlier this year. Ed
Response:
With reference to which airlines use BAe146’s, I think another DL affiliate, Comair, also has started using Bae146’s on several routes. Also, do they only use 2 engines on takeoff, and then spool the other 2 up after TO? I was on a HQ flight JFK-BOS, and I think after we took off, I heard some engine-related noise that seemed quite unusual, like a starting noise. Noise abatement??
Response:
Oops. Sorry for the redundant post before; I just saw the response to the first question. However, I doubt the spool-up was due to traffic reasons, this noise WAS the sound of a turbofan starting up, unless the BAe146’s engines sound significantly different than the big ones.
Response:
OK, here’s a new question: What is the cheapest cost for a frequent flyer mile? Eg; I’ve found one set of flights which comes out to 1.55 cents per FF mile. (including airport taxes and other fees) At this rate, after $310 worth of flights, you’d have a free flight within North America! Cheaper than buying a transcontinental ticket, and it’s more flexible than most discount fares. Anyone get anything else below 2 cents per mile?
Response:
Richard> What is the cheapest cost for a frequent flyer mile? [...] Richard> Anyone get anything else below 2 cents per mile? I pay $50/year for my Citibank AAdvantage VISA card, and can typically charge well over $5000/year (grocery stores here take credit cards…). That’s 5000 miles for $50, or 1 cent per mile. Of course, I would probably charge more if I had a real job (as opposed to being in grad school). This is a pretty easy way to run up decent amounts of FF mileage. ethan — ethan miller–cs grad student | "Why is it whatever we don’t #include <std/disclaimer.h> | – "Bones" McCoy
Response:
RS> With reference to which airlines use BAe146’s, I think another DL RS> affiliate, Comair, also has started using Bae146’s on several RS> routes. Comair has no BAe146/AvroRJ aircraft. All their jets are Canadair Regional Jets, which they are using on many routes, including Cincinnati-Providence (RI) and to Canada. — Christopher Davis # People on the net are always telling other people to "get [CKD1] MIME RIPEM # tell other people where to get a life of their own."
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As far as I know this is the only example in the world of an airline operating a single aircraft type with two radically different configurations on the same routes. TWA (at least for the couple of years where I did 20 x/c r/t per year) flies L-1011 aircraft in two configurations from SFO<->JFK; one had 2×4x2 in Business and one had 2×2x2 in Business. As a Gold Card holder (free space available upgrades to business), knowing which flights were which was useful. The 2×4x2 configuration has much smaller seats (though still larger than coach), but 2×2x2 was like most narrowbody First, and include footrests. I flew the same flight (843) every Thursday for 6 months; about 60% of the time, the aircraft was 2×2x2 (then it finally crashed and burned at JFK 
Although Several airlines operated the 146 in the US (AirCal, PSA, Presidential, later USAir, American) only Air Wisconsin and Business Express are still using them, and BEX is rumored to want to get rid of them. Really? I thought BEX just *got* them, I heard to get the reach to Detroit. Midwest spends $10-12 per coach meal … Does someone have the full list? I remember seeing this a while back, and was suprised to see that although Concorde spends about $43, (making them number two ranked) SwissAir was number one with $100 per pax in First Class … /jordan
Response:
>1) BAe 146 > Although Several airlines operated the 146 in the US (AirCal, PSA, >Presidential, later USAir, American) only Air Wisconsin and Business Express >are still using them, and BEX is rumored to want to get rid of them. They >are much more appealing to use vs traditional commuter planes, but they >don’t fit into the Boeing/Airbus/Douglas fleets of the majors well and have >a somewhat tarnished reputation as a difficult airplane to make money with.
For the record, both Air Canada’s and Canadian’s regional partners in eastern Canada (Air Nova and Air Atlantic, respectively) use 146’s.
Response:
Howdy: This post is a two-parter. 1) BAe 146 The BAe 146 is, as has been mentioned, a 100 seat, 4 engine jet made in Great Britain. It is exceptionally quiet on takeoff and landing, however don’t be too disappointed if you find that noise inside the cabin isn’t much different than other jets. Although its design was first considered in the late 1960’s it was not lauched until the late 70’s/early 80’s. Air Wisconsin put the first 200 series 146 in the world into service in June of 1983, so don’t worry about flying on an old aircraft. Plus, Air Wiscconsin has sold its oldest 146’s, so I doubt there is one in their fleet (of 12) older than perhaps six or seven years. Air Wisconsin’s 146’s have an unusual configuration. In its midwestern system it operates five 146-200’s and five newer 146-300’s. Even though the 300 series is longer and is able to seat 120 pax, both models only have 100 seats. The 200’s have 100 seats arranged six-abreast and the 300’s have 100 seats arranged five-abreast. As far as I know this is the only example in the world of an airline operating a single aircraft type with two radically different configurations on the same routes. There appears to be no set pattern as to what routes are flown by the roomier 300’s, either. It is currently easy to tell which is which–Air Wisconsin’s 200’s have white-painted engines and their 300’s have polished metal engines. (Air Wisconsin also has two 146-100’s which it operates on its Aspen CO routes–these are smaller, 86 seat jets laid out six abreast.) Although Several airlines operated the 146 in the US (AirCal, PSA, Presidential, later USAir, American) only Air Wisconsin and Business Express are still using them, and BEX is rumored to want to get rid of them. They are much more appealing to use vs traditional commuter planes, but they don’t fit into the Boeing/Airbus/Douglas fleets of the majors well and have a somewhat tarnished reputation as a difficult airplane to make money with. 2) Good Airline Service I’m surpised that no one mentioned Midwest Express as an airline with good service. I guess we here in Milwaukee have already started to take them for granted (Midwest and their commuter together are now the #1 airline here). Here’s why they get my vote: For coach and/or discounted fares (usually the same as the major airlines) you get: **2X2 seating on a DC9 or MD80, similar to other airline’s 1st class seating (Consumer Reports rated it tops in the US at 100 pts, most other airline coach seats received ratings in the 60’s or 70’s) **Without question the best meal you will ever eat in coach, bar none. The only complaint I’ve ever heard about the food was from a passenger who had to settle for Beef Wellington because they had run out of lobster by the time they got to his row. Midwest spends $10-12 per coach meal (sources vary), significantly more than even Alaska and 2x everybody else. **Service from, in general, a young, enthusiastic workforce. While it is not possible to control customer service completely, it is very easy to notice the difference between Midwest employees and those of the Big Guys here in Milwaukee. **AND you will have luxury of knowing that you are flying one of only two jet airlines in the United States that made money last year, the other being Southwest. Although Midwest serves approx 2 dozen cities, all flights go to Milwaukee. There are connecting flights (jet and commuter) at MKE to several midwestern cities if your plans take you to South Bend, Grand Rapids, etc. For those of you who don’t usually fly over the middle of the country, Midwest has flights on the following routes with a stop or connection in Milwaukee: San Francisco to/from New York La Guardia Los Angeles to/from Boston, NY, Newark, Philadelphia, Cleveland, Columbus Las Vegas to/from Boston, NY, Newark, Philadelphia, Cleveland, Columbus Denver to/from Newark, Washington DC You may find that on these longer routes that Midwest does not match the rock bottom sale fares, but it costs nothing to inquire. I know that lots of you are addicted to FF miles, but it is really worth the experience. ***A final disclaimer*** I am in no way employed or connected to either Air Wisconsin or Midwest Express Airlines. Rather, I am a flyer who is very grateful to live in the hometown of the best airline in the United States. Dale Milwaukee