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how many companies allow & pay for business class travel
Question:
> :>When he said "worst" he was referring to the class system his company > :>uses, which I personally think is despicable. So, Mr. Dissen, are you > :>suggesting that if you and your secretary travel together on business, > :>she should stay at a hotel cheaper than the one in which you stay. > Other than logistics, if the secretary is happy with the accommodations, why > not?
HUH? When it comes to secretaries, is "logistics" the whole story? Ken H
Response:
> As a side note, I use economic (= cheap) accommodations close to the client > site unless the client requests otherwise.
And if you don’t get a good nights sleep at the "cheap hotel," are you really giving your clients what they paid for? Ken H
Response:
> I can find better uses for the mileage than upgrades. An upgrade is not worth > $20/hour to me.
HERETIC!
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > : We had a very heated (and sometimes bitter) discussion about this on > : this NG last summer. I still feel the same way…unless you present to > : me as your manager a convincing arguement for FC or BC travel, I just do > : not see the point for laying out that kind of money. I sure as hell > : would not want to represent someone with a major prima-donna additude > : (and some journalists are that way). Thank god my client and I think > : alike. > The worst is the policy of my current employer, which is that one is to > fly and stay in hotels which are "equivalent to what one would purchase if > they were purchasing for their own person." IE, the secretary better stay > at the Holiday Inn while management staying in Hyatts is not viewed as > suspicious. Wierd… > My favourite was last year when I consulted to a small (and practical) > software firm. The president of the company, following company policy, > flew coach. On the same flight, I was in first thanks to frequent flier > status. Seemed a bit wierd….. > Jason
This happens to me a lot when I fly with my boss. I fly much more than he does so I often get the upgrade and he won’t. Makes things a little touchy around review time… As for our policy; ALL employees must travel coach at lowest refundable direct rate and route. International travel of more than 4 hours may be in business class, except Canada or Mexico, which we consider "domestic". Sometimes we have contracts with clients where the client will squeek about the cost of business class and may put a cap on it. In which case, we will usually eat the difference, but sometimes will force the employee to take a less direct cheaper route. For example, take LAN Chile rather than a direct flight US to Argentina. Finally, we get to keep all FF points for personal use. There are also some unwritten rules One is that we are allowed to pay slightly more to fly a non-smoking carrier if we wish. Two, we can avoid the bankrupt carriers that are likely to fold any day. Steve M.
Response:
>>>You obviously aren’t over 6 feet tall. >One of the most miserable looking groups of people I ever saw >in my life was the time I wound up on the same plane as MSU’s >basketball team returning home from an away game … coach … >in a turbo-prop …in foul weather. >(I sure hope the U isn’t makin’ ‘em fly coach right now.)
Poor guys! I was once at the gate picking up my husband. The pax started coming out and I’d never seen so many guys that were that tall! Turned out it was the Philadelphia ‘76ers. At least they were in FC. (I’ve never been to a live basketball game and they’re only a few inches high on TV 
— so it was quite stunning.)
Response:
>>You obviously aren’t over 6 feet tall.
One of the most miserable looking groups of people I ever saw in my life was the time I wound up on the same plane as MSU’s basketball team returning home from an away game … coach … in a turbo-prop …in foul weather. (I sure hope the U isn’t makin’ ‘em fly coach right now.) — Kim
Response:
It might be hard convincing them if you have a RC bill from 1976. 
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Jason’s commet regarding > >equivilant to what one would > >purchase for their own person > Now THAT is weird…I have never heard of a company policy tying their > business travel policies to what someone would purchase _on their own > time_. > So if I worked for your place, I could get written up if I booked Ritz > Carlton instead of Hilton or Holiday Inn? <g> > Maryanne. > Just stay at the R-C one time on your own, and keep the bill. That way, > you’re covered. > Ken
Response:
Logically, I would expect differences between classes of travel allowed as I know their are classes of salaries. Since I spend so little time at the hotel on a business trip, I wouldn’t be able to justify a Four Seasons to myself, let alone my company. The company, BTW, sets a maximum hotel price, but I would assume execs may not have to follow it. Like it or not, as we said in the Navy, RHIP…. Rank has its privileges. Personally, if it reduces expenses, it increases profit. My bonus and stock options give me more money when profit goes up. Michael – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > : So if I worked for your place, I could get written up if I booked Ritz > : Carlton instead of Hilton or Holiday Inn? <g> > Well, I was taken to task for staying at the Johannesburg Hyatt. I had to > bring in my Gold Passport statement and prove that yes, I really do stay > there at other times too. Wierd policy….. > Jason
Response:
: I can find better uses for the mileage than upgrades. An upgrade is not worth : $20/hour to me. There is no milage charge for last-minute upgrades on Northwest. They’re complimentary on domestic flights for Gold members. Jason
Response:
:>> :>: We had a very heated (and sometimes bitter) discussion about this on :>> :>: this NG last summer. I still feel the same way…unless you present to :>> :>: me as your manager a convincing arguement for FC or BC travel, I just do :>> :>: not see the point for laying out that kind of money. I sure as hell :>> :>: would not want to represent someone with a major prima-donna additude :>> :>: (and some journalists are that way). Thank god my client and I think :>> :>: alike. :>> :>The worst is the policy of my current employer, which is that one is to :>> :>fly and stay in hotels which are "equivalent to what one would purchase if :>> :>they were purchasing for their own person." IE, the secretary better stay :>> :>at the Holiday Inn while management staying in Hyatts is not viewed as :>> :>suspicious. Wierd… :>> Why? :>> That is exactly how I travel. :>> I wouldn’t charge a client more than I would pay if myself, if I was eating :>> the cost. :>> That applies to air, hotel, car & meals. :>> I think that is simple business ethics. :>When he said "worst" he was referring to the class system his company :>uses, which I personally think is despicable. So, Mr. Dissen, are you :>suggesting that if you and your secretary travel together on business, :>she should stay at a hotel cheaper than the one in which you stay. Other than logistics, if the secretary is happy with the accommodations, why not? I don’t see this as a class issue. As a side not, I use economic (= cheap) accommodations close to the client site unless the client requests otherwise. [ snipped ] —
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > :>: We had a very heated (and sometimes bitter) discussion about this on > :>: this NG last summer. I still feel the same way…unless you present to > :>: me as your manager a convincing arguement for FC or BC travel, I just do > :>: not see the point for laying out that kind of money. I sure as hell > :>: would not want to represent someone with a major prima-donna additude > :>: (and some journalists are that way). Thank god my client and I think > :>: alike. > :>The worst is the policy of my current employer, which is that one is to > :>fly and stay in hotels which are "equivalent to what one would purchase if > :>they were purchasing for their own person." IE, the secretary better stay > :>at the Holiday Inn while management staying in Hyatts is not viewed as > :>suspicious. Wierd… > Why? > That is exactly how I travel. > I wouldn’t charge a client more than I would pay if myself, if I was eating > the cost. > That applies to air, hotel, car & meals. > I think that is simple business ethics.
When he said "worst" he was referring to the class system his company uses, which I personally think is despicable. So, Mr. Dissen, are you suggesting that if you and your secretary travel together on business, she should stay at a hotel cheaper than the one in which you stay. > :>My favourite was last year when I consulted to a small (and practical) > :>software firm. The president of the company, following company policy, > :>flew coach. On the same flight, I was in first thanks to frequent flier > :>status. Seemed a bit wierd….. > Your choice. > I can find better uses for the mileage than upgrades. An upgrade is not worth > $20/hour to me.
Highly doubtful he used mileage. Most FFs up front are not using mileage (at least on domestic flights). He said it was due to his FF status, which likely means he qualified for a complimentary upgrade.
Response:
:>: We had a very heated (and sometimes bitter) discussion about this on :>: this NG last summer. I still feel the same way…unless you present to :>: me as your manager a convincing arguement for FC or BC travel, I just do :>: not see the point for laying out that kind of money. I sure as hell :>: would not want to represent someone with a major prima-donna additude :>: (and some journalists are that way). Thank god my client and I think :>: alike. :>The worst is the policy of my current employer, which is that one is to :>fly and stay in hotels which are "equivalent to what one would purchase if :>they were purchasing for their own person." IE, the secretary better stay :>at the Holiday Inn while management staying in Hyatts is not viewed as :>suspicious. Wierd… Why? That is exactly how I travel. I wouldn’t charge a client more than I would pay if myself, if I was eating the cost. That applies to air, hotel, car & meals. I think that is simple business ethics. :>My favourite was last year when I consulted to a small (and practical) :>software firm. The president of the company, following company policy, :>flew coach. On the same flight, I was in first thanks to frequent flier :>status. Seemed a bit wierd….. Your choice. I can find better uses for the mileage than upgrades. An upgrade is not worth $20/hour to me. — Director, Dissen Software, Bar & Grill – Israel
Response:
> Jason’s commet regarding > >equivilant to what one would > >purchase for their own person > Now THAT is weird…I have never heard of a company policy tying their > business travel policies to what someone would purchase _on their own > time_. > So if I worked for your place, I could get written up if I booked Ritz > Carlton instead of Hilton or Holiday Inn? <g> > Maryanne.
Just stay at the R-C one time on your own, and keep the bill. That way, you’re covered. Ken
Response:
> People in my line of work do it <fly economy> all the time. > And I don’t think we burn out or quit any earlier than any other > profession. Frankly, while I’d love to fly BC or FC, I don’t see the > big deal of flying coach.
You obviously aren’t over 6 feet tall.
Response:
>> People in my line of work do it <fly economy> all the time. > And I don’t think we burn out or quit any earlier than any other > profession. Frankly, while I’d love to fly BC or FC, I don’t see the > big deal of flying coach. >You obviously aren’t over 6 feet tall.
Too true. But many of my colleagues are. I do however have one colleague who’s 6′7" and who does focus his traveling so as to accumulate the most FF miles, which he uses for upgrades. But he’s VERY tall.
Response:
> I would also have to question why an employee would say that they > "needed" to fly BC or FC in light of policies that mandated Coach > travel. If they want to pay for it out of their own pocket on a > non-reimbursement situation, fine. If it is the company paying, then the > courteous thing to do would be to folow the travel policies the rest of > the company has to adhere to. > Maryanne.
Would you consider forcing someone to be confined to an economy seat for 17 hours, and the health ramifications, a "reasonable labour standard?" How much time would be reasonable to recover from such an assault on the body. My guess is that if someone was forced to make regular extended overseas trips, in economy, they’d probably burn out and/or quit in short order. Ken
Response:
: So if I worked for your place, I could get written up if I booked Ritz : Carlton instead of Hilton or Holiday Inn? <g> Well, I was taken to task for staying at the Johannesburg Hyatt. I had to bring in my Gold Passport statement and prove that yes, I really do stay there at other times too. Wierd policy….. Jason
Response:
Jason’s commet regarding >equivilant to what one would >purchase for their own person Now THAT is weird…I have never heard of a company policy tying their business travel policies to what someone would purchase _on their own time_. So if I worked for your place, I could get written up if I booked Ritz Carlton instead of Hilton or Holiday Inn? <g> Maryanne.
Response:
: We had a very heated (and sometimes bitter) discussion about this on : this NG last summer. I still feel the same way…unless you present to : me as your manager a convincing arguement for FC or BC travel, I just do : not see the point for laying out that kind of money. I sure as hell : would not want to represent someone with a major prima-donna additude : (and some journalists are that way). Thank god my client and I think : alike. The worst is the policy of my current employer, which is that one is to fly and stay in hotels which are "equivalent to what one would purchase if they were purchasing for their own person." IE, the secretary better stay at the Holiday Inn while management staying in Hyatts is not viewed as suspicious. Wierd… My favourite was last year when I consulted to a small (and practical) software firm. The president of the company, following company policy, flew coach. On the same flight, I was in first thanks to frequent flier status. Seemed a bit wierd….. Jason
Response:
One company I know of bases it on mileage for transatlantic. Also same said company will permit it if the client company is paying. My client and I discussed this and since the radio station that she works for has had funding issues from it’s government, we agreed that her flying BC or FC (on a PAID ticket, before you get your knickers all knotted up folks) could create an "image" problem. But if it was an upgrade based on her status with KLM’s FF program ("Royal Class" I think they call it), then I did not see a problem. They are one of her sponsors, and more often than not she does _not_ get the upgrade (for intra-Europe flights), but she is allowed to upgrade from the lowest Economy fare _if_ seats are available. I see it also as a safety issue—journalists have been attacked in that part of the world, and the less attention you call to yourself, the better. We had a very heated (and sometimes bitter) discussion about this on this NG last summer. I still feel the same way…unless you present to me as your manager a convincing arguement for FC or BC travel, I just do not see the point for laying out that kind of money. I sure as hell would not want to represent someone with a major prima-donna additude (and some journalists are that way). Thank god my client and I think alike. I would also have to question why an employee would say that they "needed" to fly BC or FC in light of policies that mandated Coach travel. If they want to pay for it out of their own pocket on a non-reimbursement situation, fine. If it is the company paying, then the courteous thing to do would be to folow the travel policies the rest of the company has to adhere to. Maryanne.
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > Hello > > Need info on project regarding how many companies allow & pay for business > > class travel. > > Is the trend increasing ( or decreasing) for allowing business travel > > Is there a pattern for what type of exec "can have it" on business class > > vs who is flying coach > > Anyone know of any company policies regarding companies board of directors > > for business class flights vs coach flights > > Thanks for anyone who can help > > Regards > > Greg Henderson > Boeing does for international other than Canada/Mexico. > Even to Belize or Jamaica? > Michael
Probably, but I don’t know for sure.
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Hello > Need info on project regarding how many companies allow & pay for business > class travel. > Is the trend increasing ( or decreasing) for allowing business travel > Is there a pattern for what type of exec "can have it" on business class > vs who is flying coach > Anyone know of any company policies regarding companies board of directors > for business class flights vs coach flights > Thanks for anyone who can help > Regards > Greg Henderson > Boeing does for international other than Canada/Mexico.
Even to Belize or Jamaica? Michael
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Hello > Need info on project regarding how many companies allow & pay for business > class travel. > Is the trend increasing ( or decreasing) for allowing business travel > Is there a pattern for what type of exec "can have it" on business class > vs who is flying coach > Anyone know of any company policies regarding companies board of directors > for business class flights vs coach flights > Thanks for anyone who can help > Regards > Greg Henderson
Boeing does for international other than Canada/Mexico.
Response:
Hello Need info on project regarding how many companies allow & pay for business class travel. Is the trend increasing ( or decreasing) for allowing business travel Is there a pattern for what type of exec "can have it" on business class vs who is flying coach Anyone know of any company policies regarding companies board of directors for business class flights vs coach flights Thanks for anyone who can help Regards Greg Henderson
Response:
>Hello >Need info on project regarding how many companies allow & pay for business >class travel. >Is the trend increasing ( or decreasing) for allowing business travel
I know of a large US-based consulting company in the IT industry that has tight controls on business travel. It specifies economy class travel unless the journey is over a certain duration and/or the client has agreed to pay for business class. Basically the cut-off for internal European flights is 2 hours; <2 hours = economy, >2 hours = business. For flights transatlantic or transpacific the policy for return flights is a little unusual; it’s one-way economy + one-way business (the choice to be made by the traveller depending on priorities – e.g. is there a meeting straight after the flight). I’ve used that policy to fly economy on the daytime flight and business on the overnight. I don’t know the US internal regs. >Is there a pattern for what type of exec "can have it" on business class >vs who is flying coach
Policy applies to all consultants above a certain grade. >Anyone know of any company policies regarding companies board of directors >for business class flights vs coach flights >Thanks for anyone who can help >Regards >Greg Henderson
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